ICEBOX SESSIONS

== == [00:00:00] Sean Therien: There are other lunatics, that's for sure. 10 or 15 people who rock climbed. The scene was small. [00:00:10] Sean Cassidy: I would love to talk about the gym because it's, it's kind of the, the bookends of your time here and all the amazing stuff you've done. Now [00:00:19] Sean Therien: there's an island giant boulders everywhere. [00:00:24] Sean Cassidy: Hey everybody. Welcome to another icebox session. My name is Sean Cassidy and we are in conversation with Nova Scotia Rock. Climbers. On today's episode, I have my good friend Sean Therion. Many of you I'm sure, know Sean personally, or have definitely heard about him. He's made huge contributions to our climbing scene here in Nova Scotia, beginning with his rock climbing gym, college Ground Zero. It was established in 1998. And unfortunately closed during the pandemic. There's so much material that we cover, and I think that's gonna be interesting to people. So I chunked them up into two episodes. This first part covers the start of his climbing career and getting the gym started and focuses on bouldering, primarily his pioneering and developing efforts in line of confusion. And Dover Island, both of which are near Peggy's Co. So let's get into it. First chapter. You got the gym started and then you very quickly started putting up roots. Yeah. You got a, you got a drill, which is sort of new to the area. I think maybe some of us were renting drills at that time, but you bought a drill for the gym and then, and then before that, I guess it's like you moved here specifically to open the gym. Where did you start climbing? Why did you get into it? How did you get into it? [00:01:43] Sean Therien: I started climbing. In the early nineties in Ottawa, and then at the same time I was basically making a living from cycling. Really? Yeah. Like racing, huh? And trying to like earn enough money racing to pay for food and rent. [00:02:11] Sean Cassidy: I forgot about that. I think you, you've told me about this years ago, but Yeah. I didn't realize it was that serious. [00:02:16] Sean Therien: It was pretty serious for me. [00:02:17] Sean Cassidy: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Uh, so wait, this is, um, university? [00:02:21] Sean Therien: Yeah. Like 91, 19 90. 1991. Yeah. Uh, with, with the hopes of, you know, taking it. As far as I could take it, uh, for a variety of reasons that kind of, sort of just wasn't happening. Uh, and I started getting into climbing. I lived in a house with a bunch of, with a guy who was into climbing. Yeah. And I'm like, that, that sounds kind of cool. So I started climbing with him. And then he had a friend that was also into climbing. And we didn't have any climbing gyms to climb in. 'cause climbing gyms didn't exist. So one of us, one guy had a car, another guy had a rope. We all had harnesses that, which were like basically made a seat belt and we had like enough gear to be able to lead a route. Yeah, barely. And we started going up into the gat knows. And climbing with, you know, a couple of nuts and a hacks, really. These [00:03:29] Sean Cassidy: are roommates that used. Stumbled upon [00:03:32] Sean Therien: a guy I lived with. Yeah. And his friend. And so the three of us would slowly accumulate climbing gear, like, Hey, I got another nut. You know, we almost have a full set. [00:03:44] Sean Cassidy: Yeah. I remember those days. Yeah. [00:03:45] Sean Therien: Yeah. You know, Hey, I got a hex. And like, whoa. You could only [00:03:47] Sean Cassidy: dream of a a cam. We got a cam. Yeah. Like we [00:03:50] Sean Therien: got one camp. Oh yeah. So, uh, that, yeah, that, that, that kind of happened and happened and happened. And yeah. And then we just climbed, climbed, climbed, climbed. And, and the more I climbed, the less I raced. Uh, and then rumors started to go through the Ottawa climbing community, but a climbing gym. Once we had a gym, then I really fully got into climbing and stopped riding entirely. Interesting. To keep a full-time climber. [00:04:21] Sean Cassidy: So you, you kind of trans slowly transitioned. Away from biking into climbing a pivoted [00:04:26] Sean Therien: day of, yeah, cycling right into being like a full-time climber. Right. Yeah. [00:04:31] Sean Cassidy: And what attracted you to the climbing [00:04:34] Sean Therien: for the same like entry fee or like cost of like bike parts. You could go on like a two or three week climbing trip. Yeah. Yeah. And so that really appealed to my spirit of adventure. Yeah, like this is great. I can go places and climb. I love climbing. I love traveling. I can go places and do these things. Yeah. And hard. It costs any money. [00:04:57] Sean Cassidy: It's amazingly accessible. A like I was thinking about, if you're a skier, one day passes, I mean, depending where you're at. Like over a hundred bucks. Over a hundred bucks. Whistler for sure. What, what year did Greg's gym open like that must have been one of the earlier gyms in Canada. Yeah. I think [00:05:15] Sean Therien: there were like maybe three in Canada. Yeah. [00:05:18] Sean Cassidy: So you must have at some point in there figured that, well, hey, that's a business model that might work elsewhere, right? Is that what [00:05:25] Sean Therien: Yeah. After like about eight or nine years of working in a variety of different jobs that were all great, uh, I kind of reached a point where I wanted to do my own thing, opened my own business. Uh, I did some guiding in Ottawa. Uh, and then, you know, I was, I was thinking, you know, this, I think a climbing gym is the way to go. Uh. And, and then I started exploring options for locations. And by that point, most of the major cities in Canada had at least one climbing gym, if not two. Uh, but the Maritimes was completely untouched. Uh, and I mean, I never even thought of it as a climbing destination. I just looked at it as a place where I know there are climbers. And there was no climbing gym, so it seemed like a no-brainer. [00:06:22] Sean Cassidy: Were there other cities that were on your list that kind of fit the bill similarly, and you said Winnipeg. Ooh, [00:06:29] Sean Therien: good choice. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So, uh, [00:06:34] Sean Cassidy: that must have been a, that must have been a huge step. Yeah, it's crazy. Move yourself to a totally nother province. Yep. Take a risk on starting this business where you thought maybe there's a few climbers there. Yeah, there was no climbing gym. A few climbers I knew there was a [00:06:49] Sean Therien: climbing gym because, or not gym, but I knew there was a climbing community 'cause they community had opened their arms up to me when I came out here to visit. Uh, they had a barbecue for me. Deb Stover and Neil McPherson were super friendly people. Were the Todd Foster you. Mike Mason, there was like a small group of people, Colin Matthews. Everyone was like really receptive to me, even though they didn't know me, uh, and to the idea of a climbing gym. So when I, when I finally did move here. Yeah, I didn't really know anyone or have any friends, but I already kind of felt like [00:07:31] Sean Cassidy: there was a community. That There was a community grab. Yeah. [00:07:33] Sean Therien: And they were ready to rally around me. Yeah. [00:07:36] Sean Cassidy: And I remember being excited about that prospect of you opening a gym. I can't remember how we got all connected. I'm assuming it was through cle, Nova Scotia. Somehow it Nova Scotia. Yeah. Whi because Deb and Lil, [00:07:48] Sean Therien: yeah. [00:07:49] Sean Cassidy: Were part of that at that time, I think. [00:07:51] Sean Therien: Yeah. They big time. [00:07:52] Sean Cassidy: Yeah. So. Um, Dal Plex existed Yeah. Before you guys came. Yeah. So a small wall. Yeah. Does it still, is it still there? [00:08:00] Sean Therien: Yeah. And the Rock court, the, the [00:08:02] Sean Cassidy: original one. Oh, the Rock Court came many years later, but [00:08:05] Sean Therien: I'm pretty sure that you, the wall is still up in the field house as well. I haven't heard about it getting ripped down. Yeah. So [00:08:11] Sean Cassidy: I mean, I, it was a great thing for me. I spent a lot of time Yeah. On that wall. Yeah. Before Ground zero was built. [00:08:17] Sean Therien: Totally. I mean, when you think about it, before something like that existed. You know, like you, you went to Queens, so you climbed in their training facility. Yeah. Rocks. Rocks glued to a wall in, in the basement. I loved it. You, you fell onto a concrete floor. Yeah. Because crash pads weren't invented yet. [00:08:34] Sean Cassidy: No. We sometimes we would use carpet. Remember those days? There you go. A couple, [00:08:37] Sean Therien: yeah. Cut some carpet. [00:08:39] Sean Cassidy: Yeah. Carpet. Carpet. To clean your feet off. Yeah. At the crags. You're a real, a real boulder if you had a piece of carpet. [00:08:45] Sean Therien: Yeah. Yeah. It was super high. Tech [00:08:48] Sean Cassidy: times have changed a little bit. [00:08:49] Sean Therien: Yeah. [00:08:50] Sean Cassidy: Okay. So what, uh, from your perspective, what, what did the scene look like when you first moved out? You said there's, you know, some people rallied around pretty quickly, a couple handfuls of people maybe, and were keen to have you open shop. [00:09:05] Sean Therien: The scene was small 'cause you, you knew everyone, like everyone who climbed, basically knew each other. There were, it seemed to me like maybe. 10 true or 15 people who rock climbed. [00:09:21] Sean Cassidy: I I would agree. Yeah. [00:09:22] Sean Therien: That and like if you said 20, then I think that would be reaching. Yeah. Uh, and, and, and, and so yeah, the scene was small, uh, and people knew each other. [00:09:33] Sean Cassidy: You must have been freaking out like, oh my God, I'm opening a climbing gym and there's like a dozen people that climb. What have I done? [00:09:40] Sean Therien: Yeah, yeah. That was I bit of a concern. Yeah. Yeah, I know doubt, that's for sure. Uh. But yeah, I, this, yeah. So the scene was small and mostly revolved around outdoor climbing. 'cause there wasn't mm-hmm. Much, there was not really much for indoor climbing. Uh, yeah. But it, it sure, sure. Started to grow quickly, that's for sure. [00:10:05] Sean Cassidy: Do you remember your first experiences climbing here once you, I don't even know if you did. We probably took you out bouldering. [00:10:11] Sean Therien: My first experience was. I, I was, I got insanely sick when we were building the gym. Oh, yeah. And we, I think you and Colin, maybe Jonathan Graham took me to, uh, first phase. Oh, for a day. Just, we just, we just, it was February. It was sunny. It was hot. I was like, wow, it's February. Yeah. Crazy. And it's nice. It's like I'm living in Ottawa and it's not nice in February, you know? So we went out to first base and. I don't even, I, I didn't climb 'cause I was super ill, but I remember lying at the base of first base looking up and someone was pointing at the roots to me. And I was just thinking, wow, this cliff is awesome. Like, this thing is amazing. It's beautiful. Like I'm up on these boulders. There's this lake below me, there's these amazing sport routes. Uh, there's some trad routes. This looks legit. And then I remember thinking or asking. About a feature on the wall and like, what's, what's that route? Like, it doesn't seem to have any bolts on it. Like, how come there's no bolts on that? That looks amazing. And I think you or whoever it was, was like, oh yeah, like that's, that's nothing like that. That's just hasn't nothing, there's nothing, you know, like that's not a root, like how is that not a root? And then I quickly realized if this is just one of the cliffs that are here and this line on it that looks incredible, hasn't been developed, what else is out there? And, and, and yeah, everything changed at that point for me. [00:11:56] Sean Cassidy: So the route we're talking about is, is the ERT. Yeah. Right of April. Cool. Yeah. [00:12:01] Sean Therien: Blue Sky Mining, [00:12:02] Sean Cassidy: which is a beautiful striking ette natural line. Beautiful. Chases up to the sky. Yeah. Put [00:12:08] Sean Therien: you in an incredible position in that scooped out. Mm-hmm. Arch. You know, there's a hold there. Like what if there's no hold there? Yeah. Probably won't go. It'll be garbage. Yeah. But there's like a jug right there and you can just chill, relax, and enjoy the view. [00:12:23] Sean Cassidy: It's great. Kind of. Yeah. Um, so that route. It doesn't get climbed too much. [00:12:29] Sean Therien: Yeah. [00:12:31] Sean Cassidy: Do you know why [00:12:32] Sean Therien: the first boat's kind of high? [00:12:37] Sean Cassidy: I feel like when you first moved here, I felt, I mean, partly it was you had the gym going, so it was kind of indoor plastic climbing, which is sort of a new beast at the time, you know? Yeah. Like there was from here, not a lot of, for Nova Scotia or anywhere really, I feel like. [00:12:51] Sean Therien: Yeah. I, I. Had been around like, you know, I moved here in 97 Rock Headss Coyotes. They, they'd been around. For a good six or seven years. Okay. You know, I'd been at West Climbed in the Nationals at, uh, at the Edge in Vancouver. Okay. Like three or four years before I moved here. Oh wow. [00:13:10] Sean Cassidy: You were a com you in the competition climbing? Yeah, I [00:13:12] Sean Therien: did a lot of competitive climbing. Oh, cool. Yeah. Like, you know, way, way back then, uh, Quebec. And, uh, Ontario, I hitchhiked across the country to climb in the nationals in Vancouver. Wow. Yeah. Wow. So, yeah. Yeah. You know, I was making money off of that a little bit. Or pro climber. Pro climber, you know. Damn. [00:13:36] Sean Cassidy: Are you, um, are you competitive by nature? I didn't like your. Competing in the biking and trying to make a living outta that. And I forgot you were competing and climbing as well. Yeah, [00:13:46] Sean Therien: I guess so. Is that a, [00:13:47] Sean Cassidy: is that kind of running your veins? [00:13:49] Sean Therien: Yeah, I think it must a little bit, yeah. Yeah. I mean, for me it does, you know? Uh, yeah, I just, I like What [00:13:56] Sean Cassidy: drives you with organized competition like that? [00:14:01] Sean Therien: I guess I like the, I like the process of like preparing for, for an event like that. And then I like. What it means to have, to try and be at your best on a certain day. And, and, and, and, and then I like the nuances of what's involved in being at your best. You know, there's lots of little subtleties to, to competition, uh, whether it's bike racing, probably more so for climbing. Yeah. You know, you, the margin for air is a lot less. You know, if you, if, if you take more than one try, that could cost you a win. So flashing is really important. Or, uh, you know, your foot dabs the ground, that's a try. So like if you're outside or if you're just climb for fun, that's no big deal, but. In a competition, that's a big deal. So I kind of like [00:15:03] Sean Cassidy: that. So focused performance to that needs to occur at that moment. Yeah. You like that's pressure, I guess. Yeah, pressure. [00:15:10] Sean Therien: I like that pressure. I like how I like that pressure. Yeah. Because I, I found that pressure useful for climbing in the real world, like real world climbing. I, I think competition climbing is, is really good and helpful for people that are serious about. Real world climbing. [00:15:29] Sean Cassidy: How so? [00:15:30] Sean Therien: Well, it's getting dark. You're, you're getting tired. Your skin's getting weak and you may only have one try left on this thing. And it, you could be on a climbing trip. You've gotta fly home the next day, you know? And you want to do this climb. So if you can do it sooner, then you're not even in that position. Yeah. But if you can't do it sooner, yeah. And you've got one try left. Well. It's, it's, that's finals time. You know, you're, it's like you're in the finals game on, game on. You're tired, you're rote, you still gotta perform. You get one shot, you get one shot and that's it. So competition climbing can be really good for that. [00:16:11] Sean Cassidy: What about, um, I was gonna ask this later, but training for climbing, not just the mental part, which we were kind of talking about, but I feel like. Not, not competition stuff, but just keeping your body in shape to tackle all those roots and problems that you developed over the years. I feel like you approached it a little bit more with a bit more rigor than I ever did, and may, maybe I'm wrong. [00:16:37] Sean Therien: No, I, I. I naturally probably suck at a lot of the activities I do. Uh, climbing in particular. Uh, [00:16:49] Sean Cassidy: you suck at climbing. [00:16:49] Sean Therien: I suck at climbing. Oh, that's crazy. Yeah. And oh, you don't like the only, the only, the only way I could have done any of the things that I did, uh, was through like serious, serious training. Yeah, I did a lot of, of supplementary work besides just climbing to enable my body to survive the assault that I would put it through. Yeah. Uh, developing roots, uh. And then just climbing, like, just climbing in gen. You know, climbing in general required me to train a lot. Uh, and then route development is a whole other beast. Yeah. [00:17:34] Sean Cassidy: So tell us more about how you would train to not suck at climbing. [00:17:41] Sean Therien: Uh. I would try and I did like a lot of, a lot of core work. Tons and tons of core work. Uh, [00:17:50] Sean Cassidy: sit ups, [00:17:51] Sean Therien: sit ups, crunches, ab crushes, leg lifts. Uh, I did a lot of work on hang board. I did a lot of work on a system board. Uh, I didn't do any campus training whatsoever 'cause that was just, uh, not for me. Uh, [00:18:10] Sean Cassidy: you had a backer ladder at one point, [00:18:12] Sean Therien: used a backer ladder in the backyard, rock rings, all these different tools that exist. Uh, I used all of them. Yeah. And did [00:18:20] Sean Cassidy: you make that stuff up or were you following like a training program? [00:18:23] Sean Therien: I feel like, what was that? Eric Horst had a, Eric Horst had a, a pretty good book. Yeah. Uh, I, I followed a lot of his guide, his principles of training. Uh, and a lot of it was just, you know, kind of like. Figuring out what worked for me intensity wise, load wise, uh, and then trying to have targeted rest periods where, you know, like for instance, in a 12 month cycle, I would like pick a month and just not climb. Nice. Yeah. Like for a whole month I just try not to climb for a month. I think that's [00:18:54] Sean Cassidy: important to recover the body. I did that, you know, I would take winters off just 'cause I, yeah. And I would come back feeling stronger. [00:19:01] Sean Therien: Big time. [00:19:02] Sean Cassidy: Yeah. [00:19:02] Sean Therien: Yeah. What do they call it? I think it's in one like. Jerry Moffitt's books, the Reminiscence Effect. Oh. Which I taught a lot of my, my, oh, tell me [00:19:13] Sean Cassidy: about this sounds, this sounds cool. [00:19:14] Sean Therien: Yeah, it's super cool. So, I mean, Jerry, anyone that knows Jerry knows about his motorcycle accident where he completely annihilated himself and was. I heard of climbing for well over a year. [00:19:27] Sean Cassidy: Right. So maybe back up and just tell a, I bet a lot of people listening wouldn't really know who Jerry Moffitt [00:19:32] Sean Therien: is. Yeah. Maybe, I'm [00:19:33] Sean Cassidy: guessing [00:19:34] Sean Therien: if you don't know who Jerry Moffitt is, get yourself schooled. Yeah. Yeah. Best climb, best climber in the world. Like one of the, one of the three best climbers in the world in the eighties, uh, and British. British, uh, tough as nails crashed, his motorcycle rode off completely. He came back to climbing after a year off, and within I think two months climbed like the hardest route in the world. He attributed it to the fact that over that period of time where he hadn't been climbing. His brain deleted all the garbage that he had like downloaded from climbing. So all the training sessions where you're climbing with bad tech, bad technique, you're fatigued, you've got sloppy footwork, you know you're over gripping all the, all the bad stuff that you do. When, when you stop doing that activity for an extended period of time, your brain deletes the bad stuff and only remembers the good stuff. [00:20:42] Sean Cassidy: Ooh, I I love this. Is this real? [00:20:44] Sean Therien: This is real and it works. Yeah, [00:20:47] Sean Cassidy: this is cool. [00:20:48] Sean Therien: Yeah. Super cool. So there's, there are many other climbers who've gone through a similar thing where they've been injured out for quite a period of time. Come back and they're climbing better than when they, before they were injured. [00:21:02] Sean Cassidy: Yeah, because I, I always thought that was like, I hear about that part and I feel like it's okay. A climber's body really gets butchered, I think, you know, like Yeah, the tendons and the shoulders and elbows and fingers and all that stuff. And I always just, okay, so you, you blow a, a 10 a pulley or something and you're out for a couple months that it's, yeah, your pulley recovers, but. Also the rest of your body gives a, gets a chance to recover. [00:21:28] Sean Therien: So physically, so I kind of [00:21:28] Sean Cassidy: thought it was a more of a physical [00:21:30] Sean Therien: recovery. It's, it's definitely a physical thing, but it's also like a mental thing. Uh, and I've been out, you know, with injuries on my own for extended periods of time. Uh, and yeah, it works, it helps you when you start climbing again, your footwork is super crisp. There's like a, a short, a short a, like a really brief period where. You kind of get reacquainted with the movement. Yeah. And then it just clicks and you're like, wow, I'm not, I'm not as strong as I was. Yeah. But I'm climbing harder than I was. How is that possible? [00:22:06] Sean Cassidy: I love, I love this. Yeah. It's, um, you know, as you know, I'm kind of like addicted to surfing right now. I'm trying to learn that stuff. And the swell is so fickle around here. You can, you can, like, I had a stretch for two weeks where I couldn't. Surf and I was like, oh, I'm like, you know, losing my gains that I was making in terms of, you know, learning certain maneuvers on the wave. And then I would come back and yeah, it was like, oh, this is, this feels right, this feels good. And I mean, I hope what you're saying is true. I'm gonna look this up. Reminiscence effect, like to, to purge the, the, the garb or the noise around whatever you're. Yeah. What, um, speaking of training, oh, so that's, that's really interesting, like the kind of breadth of the, and your focus on training. I, I knew a little bit about that, but not, not maybe, maybe the extent. [00:22:58] Sean Therien: Yeah. I brought training, like I really brought, like a lot of people would come to me and ask me to train them at the gym over the years, and very few, if any, ever were like actually. Prepared to commit to what was required. [00:23:16] Sean Cassidy: Right. It's not fun to [00:23:18] Sean Therien: train. Yeah. Training's, it's, it's, it's kind of not fun. It's, it's kind of fun if you like to train. Yeah. But if you don't like to train, then training's not fun. Yeah. And if you, if you don't like to train, then don't, don't, don't pretend to train. Right. Just climb. Yeah. Or just, just do your activity. [00:23:39] Sean Cassidy: I'm just realizing, talking to you because an underlying kind of like facet of your personalities. I think you like suffering and I think I'm just putting it together that, you know, in my mind, training is sort of suffering. But you like that. [00:23:54] Sean Therien: Yeah. You know, you like [00:23:55] Sean Cassidy: that in your, your extreme biking that you're doing now and maybe we'll talk about that a bit later. Or your crazy route development. Marathons that you would do up at Cape Player, for example? Yeah. Yeah. It's, I thinks all, I think, I think you like suffering. [00:24:07] Sean Therien: I kind of like suffering. It's, it's, it's part of the process, I guess, and it makes the rewards at the end more delicious. Mm-hmm. Yeah. [00:24:19] Sean Cassidy: You open the gym, you got that going, you got excited about new roots and you put up, uh, blue Sky Mining, I think was the first. That was the first you put up. Yep. Yeah. And then. Like, what are some of the other ones at that, in that era, which was, when was that Late, late nineties kind of stuff. [00:24:38] Sean Therien: Yeah, so the late nineties I put up blue sky mining. And then the summer hit. And obviously in Nova Scotia it's kind of hard to do a lot of rope climbing 'cause it's so buggy and hot. So I got a taste of some of the coastal bouldering and I was like, that's pretty cool. I didn't, you know, know much about that. Yep. It's pretty neat stuff. Uh, 'cause I was coming from like a. Rope climbing background. I, you know, Boulder, you know, we met in Waco, so I I But you [00:25:11] Sean Cassidy: say that [00:25:12] Sean Therien: bouldering was, you know, there wasn't, it wasn't huge like it is now. I mean, people went to Waco, to Boulder. Yeah. That was kind of it, you know, maybe in terms of a destination back then. Yeah. You know, and uh, and here it seemed like people bolded. In the summertime on the coast 'cause it was too hot to spark, climb or, or trad climb. Yeah. Right. It's too hot and too buggy. So you went to the coast? [00:25:37] Sean Cassidy: Yeah, [00:25:38] Sean Therien: so I went to the coast just like everybody else did and got it. Got saw the coastal areas and was like, wow, that's pretty cool. It's super fun. You can climb in the summer here and, and, and it's really hot. Fall rolled around and we drove out to Peggy's Cove. And we, you know, made that turn on the, on the road where you can see across the barons. And I hadn't been out to Peggy's Cove yet since I had moved here 'cause I was too busy doing other stuff. And all I saw was like an wasteland of, of exposed rock and giant boulders everywhere. [00:26:20] Sean Cassidy: Yeah. [00:26:21] Sean Therien: I was just like. All right, well, what's going on here? What's with all these giant granite boulders, like 10 feet off the road. And, and that was, that was, that was the finding of the land of confusion. You know, we slammed the brakes on the car. We got out instead of walking towards the ocean, we walked away from the ocean inland. Yeah, and we just started finding stuff and on day one we found the scoop boulder, like the scoop boulder. We found that on day one, so my entire world completely changed and I, I don't actually think I put up that many sport route for a while. 'cause Yeah. [00:27:03] Sean Cassidy: You basically stopped. Yeah. It seemed like, and you were fully focused on, on the bouldering. [00:27:08] Sean Therien: Yeah. The LLC consumed me for I think two or three years. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Like four days a week, every week. Yeah. Driving back there. And I know you were putting stuff up. Yeah. [00:27:23] Sean Cassidy: So what are some of the, your favorite problems that got put up during that time? Do you remember? Oh, do you remember any of them? I mean, there's so many, [00:27:31] Sean Therien: there's so many. I mean, obviously B Gun was B gun. That was, [00:27:35] Sean Cassidy: that's a route I think, isn't it? [00:27:36] Sean Therien: Yeah. No. Boulder problem. Boulder problem. Right? Yeah. Okay. He was listening to a lot of Parliament Funkadelic at the time. And, and, uh, yeah. That, that problem had a move on it that seemed very appropriate to, to bop gun. He had to bop up. Yeah. Stellar, uh, Mr. Freeze on the mega Boulder was a really important, uh, problem for me 'cause it was high and, uh, it, it was really high. And, and, uh. I think it was maybe the first problem that went up on the mega boulder. So, so that, that was, that was a significant problem for me. Yeah. You asked me if I'm competitive a, a little bit maybe sometimes. I, I like, I like the idea of a first ascent. Uh, I like it 'cause. I think it's cool to think that you're the first person that's ever been in this place. Yeah. And this place could be like perched on a piece of rock, 10 feet off the ground. No person's ever been there before, you know? Uh, or this, or it could be you're up on a cliff somewhere. You know, you're the first person that's ever been on this ledge. Uh, but also I kind of like the idea of a first ascent because. You and a bunch of people might be trying to do something and you get to do it first. [00:29:04] Sean Cassidy: Sure. Yeah. And that's kind, it's a good feeling. That's kind of cool. Yeah. [00:29:07] Sean Therien: You know, it's not really a in your face thing and definitely never had like a competitive. Like thing going, but [00:29:15] Sean Cassidy: that was a dri that was a driver to get that done first. It, it can be a drive. [00:29:18] Sean Therien: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Like three year close when you gets it. All right. You got it. [00:29:21] Sean Cassidy: Yeah. Yeah. I mean that, that discovery and exploration, I mean, it's, it's sort of a privilege, right? Because it's, it hap the timing happened to be such that you were, I mean, you had the energy and the initiative and all that stuff, but huge, you, you're able to able to have that experience. Yeah. Which, which is wild. [00:29:39] Sean Therien: So every time we thought we'd, we'd seen it all. We'd find a whole other area. Like when I found Dover Island, everything changed, [00:29:49] Sean Cassidy: you know? Oh, oh yeah. [00:29:50] Sean Therien: Because it was like, oh, now there's an island. I found that, 'cause I was looking for roots. Hmm. And I had heard that there was a cliff on the island. So I paddled over there in a kayak and found the cliff and was stoked on all these super rad trad lines and then saw everything else. And [00:30:15] Sean Cassidy: did you camp that first night when you were there? [00:30:17] Sean Therien: No, I, I did like one boulder problem with a and, and then that was it paddled back to mainland. Right. And then. Quickly returned with a rope and a trad rack. Right. And put down all those tra lines. Yeah. Yeah. And then the bouldering commenced. Yeah. And it was just a frenzy. That was crazy. It was crazy. Yeah. Just like, wow, this is insane. Mega mega, like mega five star project going down after another. Yeah, just insane. [00:30:50] Sean Cassidy: With zero scrubbing. [00:30:51] Sean Therien: Zero scrubbing. And the best part was you could go back like a week later and there was no trace whatsoever that anyone had ever climbed there. Like all chalk on and no garbage. Just pristine. Perfect. Amazing granite. It was insane. [00:31:09] Sean Cassidy: So I mean, that's, that's one of the premier, if we, if Nova Scotia has a premier climbing destination, I'd have to believe it's, it's gotta be Dover Island. Dover Island, yeah. I mean, the roots, we, we have a lot of fun on the roots, but they're not, they're not world class. I don't know if Dora's world class, but it's, it's pretty darn good. Doable. Yeah. And I think, um, not too long after you, uh, discovered that. We started organizing a, a Boulder Fest. Yeah. There, right? Yeah. Um, yeah, it [00:31:40] Sean Therien: started off as like the summer meltdown, right? So like a festival organized through, through ground zero. Uh, and then it just, you know, it became bigger. Mm-hmm. Uh, and, and, and then we, you know, parted up with Climb Nova Scotia and then it became bigger and I was kind of like. It's too big for me. [00:32:02] Sean Cassidy: It's a lot of organization. Yes. Yeah. Yeah. [00:32:03] Sean Therien: Now that we're gonna have like a hundred people on the island, I'm just gonna tap out, uh, and be, be a part, a sponsor, uh, and a volunteer. I don't wanna organize anymore. Uh, and yeah, that went on for many, many years. [00:32:18] Sean Cassidy: For all those years. Like I'm thinking Atlanta Confusion and Dover Island. In my mind, you were kind of in my mind. You were a boulderer at that time. You know, I didn't, I didn't hear you doing much roots. Um, but like through your history of climbing here, you've, I think chain you've redefined yourself a few, few times. And in my perspective, and from, from that bouldering phase, I don't know why, why this transition, but, and I'm thinking that the spot for the G spot, what you guys called it back then. Was that the next kind of, that would've been chapter [00:32:54] Sean Therien: That would've been a big catalyst. Yeah. So during like the bouldering development years, I was putting up roots still. Okay. Uh, but like individual roots at individual cliffs, so, you know, go to a cliff, put up a route, go to a cliff, put up a route. Uh, no, like big, like area development rope wise, more like individual route. Yeah. Here's, here's a cliff. There's a route. Bolt sand. Uh, and then after having like put in, you know, years in LLC, all the other areas out there, uh, getting everything sorted out on Do Island that I felt I was capable of doing. Uh, we, we, we were, you know, I was looking for more. I had seen the cliffs where the spot is, you know, you drew, you drive by them all the time. You see them from the road. Yep. Everything we'd heard about them was their garbage. So don't bother. So I, I hiked in there with, uh. Jess, Jess Gilbert, and looking for boulders. We had crash pads and we found one, but we found huge cliffs instead. Uh, and I just was like, what the hell? [00:34:13] Sean Cassidy: This isn't garbage. [00:34:15] Sean Therien: These I can't even, like, these are huge cliffs back here. They're not garbage at all. And I was back there within like a week, I think, [00:34:25] Sean Cassidy: with Todd. And then for the next two years, [00:34:26] Sean Therien: yeah. Uh, wrapped. We, you know, we wrapped, we figured out a way to get to the top. We wrapped down the first couple roots there, uh, fat Tuesday and flaking. Uh. And we're just like, these things are huge. Like these are like, this is a, these are full pitch roots. Uh, and then that was it. Development of that area. Just consumed, yeah, consumed my existence. I remember going to Mac and just buying all the bolts and hangers they had like, gimme me everything you got, I'm gonna need it all. [00:35:05] Sean Cassidy: Alright, so that's heart one. I hope you enjoyed it and you're starting to get a feel for the body of Sean's work. Thanks to my sponsors for helping me get this podcast off the ground. And a big special thanks to ground zero for keeping us all off the deck. Catch you later. [00:35:25] Sean Therien: And then. We finished the day at SOL's end. Yeah, we did. Uh, it's a [00:35:28] Sean Cassidy: big day. [00:35:29] Sean Therien: That laid back route, whatever that one's called. Recognition. Recognition, yeah. De recognition. Mm. Finished the day on top of SOL's end [00:35:36] Sean Cassidy: and that was the big stupid, big stupid. Yeah. Sounds pretty stupid. It [00:35:38] Sean Therien: was dumb.