ICEBOX SESSIONS

_______________________________________________________________________ [00:00:00] Therien: Pow Pow, pow pow There's lines everywhere. Anyone who sent it, if you sent it using a pile of cheater stones, consider your send invalid. My, my ethics are questionable. They're, they're flexible. [00:00:17] Cassidy: Hey, everybody. Welcome to another Ice Box session. My name is Sean Cassidy, and we are in conversation with Nova Scotia Rock Climbers. Big thanks to Granite Guides for supporting this episode. This is part two of my conversation. With Sean Therien, former gym owner, bouldering pioneer, prolific route developer, and all around king of suffering. As you shall hear, this episode is mostly about route climbing from the spot in the Musquodoboit Valley to Cape Clear up in Cape Breton. Hang onto your hats. There's a lot of suffering in this one. We begin at the spot. [00:00:54] Therien: We just started clearing at the base, putting in routes, uh, getting things sorted out. [00:01:00] Cassidy: There was a lot of work that you guys put in there. I mean, that was, the amount of growth on that cliff was Yeah. Insane. Yeah. And I, I am partly to blame for referring to the place as garbage. I remember Steve Punshon and I were looked at it years, years before that, and to us it looked like. Just low angle, overgrown garbage. Yeah. You know? Yeah. And, and you came with a different, totally different vision for it. And a stomach to excavate like you would not believe. And you unearthed some pretty awesome lines. [00:01:35] Therien: You're in deep when you're rappeling off the top of a cliff with like. A trowel and a shovel and six brushes and a variety of gardening tools. Yeah. You know, uh, but yeah, we, we, we excavated on earth cleaned and, and in the end developed, you know, one of the best climbing areas in the province. I think, uh, super accessible. Mm-hmm. Good routes. We, you know, well bolted, uh, for the most part, I think, uh, loved it. Just loved that experience. [00:02:11] Cassidy: Were you involved in the development of the castle later? Because it has a very similar style, I think. [00:02:18] Therien: Yeah. Kind of the routes there were, were, were, I felt like pure lines as well. Mm-hmm. Yeah. Like, uh, the, the lines, there were pure lines, uh, very well bolted. Uh, for the most part. Uh, I didn't. See like grid bolting there, or like once a, once a line went up because the routes are a little bit shorter, you didn't really see like. Variations, maybe the rock quality there didn't really lead to that. Mm-hmm. But the routes, you know, the last time I climbed there anyway, the routes still kind of had their integrity and, and, and, and, uh, I, I kind of thought that was, I like that, like I like a route to maintain its integrity. Yeah. Yeah. [00:03:04] Cassidy: Nice. Yeah. And development of those two Crags, I think. I think, if I'm remembering right, you and Todd did a lot of that stuff together. Is that right? [00:03:12] Therien: Yeah. For the spot, we were, we [00:03:15] Cassidy: you were a duo. [00:03:16] Therien: We were, yeah. We, the two of us just pounded it. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, the, the castle kind of got developed, not without me, but like it was Fat Jack, [00:03:27] Cassidy: Jack, uh, Jack Bennett, maybe [00:03:29] Therien: the castle had an air of secrecy to it, so it was found. Development started. Mm-hmm. It was kept secret. Uh, and then once I think the developers got the lines in that they wanted, then they made it public. Oh, right. Uh, and then, then other people came in and, you know, there were more lines to do. So I put up some routes [00:03:50] Cassidy: and Yeah. You put up a really, really hard one on that. A rat [00:03:54] Therien: I put up. Yeah. Uh, I put up a couple tens, I put up a route that I, for me was like. Five 13. Yeah, it's probably like one of the hardest things I've done on Rock. What's that one called? Battle Slam. Battle Slam. Yeah. That looks gnarly. Yeah, it was. It is like, you wanna talk about training? Like I specifically trained for that route for a. Like two months. Yeah. It it like the worst part of that route was it, it, there was a move on it that I had to do where I kind of had to do like a dead point to like a, a slot where your fingers kind of slide into a crack and if my fingers blow or if my feet blow. And my fingers stick. I'm gonna rip my fingers off. Yeah. Uh, and that was really scary. Uh, yeah. So yeah, that route was really, really super hard and quite frightening, uh, for that move. It looks [00:04:45] Cassidy: gnarly. I, I've looked at it and I can't imagine really doing it. It looks. Painful and kind of stretchy, you know, or like hard to get up into that. Starting the [00:04:54] Therien: crux was, so, the crux was like, yeah. Getting off the ground basically. Yeah. Uh, and then getting past the first bolt. And weirdly enough, several times when I, when it was working it, and I would go out there, I would find a big pile of cheater stones pile up at the bottom. So. Anyone who sent it, if you sent it using a pile of cheater stones, consider your sin invalid. Invalid. [00:05:26] Cassidy: You, you do have, uh, it's funny, I'm thinking you, you've always been a stickler for, uh, tick marks. [00:05:33] Therien: Yes. TMLF forever. [00:05:35] Cassidy: What t? What does that stand for? [00:05:37] Therien: Take Mark. [00:05:37] Cassidy: Liberation Front. Oh, right, yes. Is this your own entity or Colin Matthews and I formed it, the [00:05:44] Therien: TMLF. So we, yeah. Tell [00:05:46] Cassidy: us about the TMLF. [00:05:47] Therien: TMLF. We were on a road trip to Red Rocks and we were appalled. We were shocked and offended. Wow. Yeah. Uh, by how every single hold on every single route. Yeah. Had foot long tick marks. Oh, that's gross. So yeah, we formed the TMLF. It's got a membership of two and yeah, we would do a route and then we'd, uh, when wed lower off, we'd scrub off all the tick marks. Clean the route up [00:06:13] Cassidy: on your trip or here? Yeah, both. Okay. [00:06:16] Therien: Yeah. We're like, yeah, you know what? Yeah. We're gonna clean up these tick marks. [00:06:19] Cassidy: Yeah. Does that happen a lot here? Do you find people ticking sometimes? Foot. Foot and handholds? Yeah. I mean, on the, on the limits of our abilities. Obviously we, we need some of those cheater [00:06:31] Therien: tick marks are tick marks are fine, man. Yeah. Just, just [00:06:34] Cassidy: clean 'em up. Clean ' [00:06:35] Therien: em off when you're done. [00:06:36] Cassidy: Yep. And why, why would you, why do you, [00:06:38] Therien: looks like crap. [00:06:40] Cassidy: Looks like crap. [00:06:40] Therien: Looks like crap. [00:06:41] Cassidy: Yeah. [00:06:41] Therien: Yeah. [00:06:43] Cassidy: And I suppose the experience, it, it probably makes the experience for the next person different. [00:06:48] Therien: It changes the onsite. [00:06:50] Cassidy: Yeah. [00:06:50] Therien: If you're trying to onsite and you see a big foot long tick mark, you're probably gonna aim for it. [00:06:55] Cassidy: Yeah. [00:06:57] Therien: So, yeah, visually it's, it, it looks bad and it, you can, it contained your onsite a little bit. So if you want like a pure onsite, you don't wanna know where the next hole is. You wanna find the next hole. Oh, you're climbing? [00:07:13] Cassidy: No tick marks and no cheater stones. That's the other. Definitely not no cheat. What about like, uh, do you ever climb, um, pyramid out at first phase? Remember this, like, this is gnarly kind of boulder problem off the ground. Um, you get to allege you can continue to do sins and transgressions above it. I think I've climbed that. Or if you go, is that way to the left? Uh, it's in the middle. [00:07:37] Therien: Okay. Maybe it's in the [00:07:38] Cassidy: middle. [00:07:38] Therien: Yeah. [00:07:39] Cassidy: Anyways. Ever since I moved here. There was a cheater stone blocks at the bottom, which is super helpful. 'cause otherwise you just can't Yeah. Grab the holes and there's no gear, uh, for like 15 feet or so. Whoa. So yeah, I like those cheater stones [00:07:59] Therien: after the bowling kind of seemed to die off for me. Yeah. Like, not for lack of interest, but for lack of what seemed available. Uh, then yeah, I, I, my, my focus switched to putting up routes. Uh, so I spent. Quite a long period of time at Columbus Wall putting up a bunch of routes there. Uh, I forgot about that. Yeah. And they were, that was super fun. And then what [00:08:28] Cassidy: are some of those lines that, um, you put up during that time? Is desperado there? [00:08:34] Therien: Desperado? Yeah. Yeah. That thing is there. Uh, there's a project that I, I tried that I, I just abandoned, uh, flying squirrel project, I think Sean Smith. I sent that. Oh, is that thet? Yep. Yeah. Okay. Slopey arête. Mm-hmm. Uh, couple, couple five tens. Fun stuff. Just like, you know, filling in the blanks. Yep. You know, with bolts grid bolting. Yeah. It's great. Grid bolting. I love it. I love it. I love it. Cheaters stones. My, my ethics are questionable. Yeah, they're flexible. They're flexible. They're flexible. Yeah. Uh, and, uh, and then yeah, the next, the next after that would've been, would've been the Spot G spot. [00:09:16] Cassidy: Oh, [00:09:16] Therien: okay. Yeah. Columbus first. [00:09:18] Cassidy: Okay. Columbus first. Yeah. Then spot, and then you threw in main face. So the, so after after the spot, the spot, [00:09:23] Therien: I was like, I'm gonna go check out main face. I had never really climbed in main face. Right. More than once or twice. Yeah. 'cause I kind of thought it was a choss pile. Mm-hmm. You know, I, I [00:09:33] Cassidy: But you, you, you finished developing. Spots you thought, well, [00:09:37] Therien: yeah. Like, well, [00:09:38] Cassidy: I haven't, maybe it's not a Chas pile. Maybe it's [00:09:39] Therien: not a Chas pile. Let's go in there and check it out. And yeah, it definitely was not a Chas pile. And, and, and it was insane. Like, the amount of routes that were, like, the amount of just like sections of rock that weren't touched was insane. And so I just went hog wild. I know how many routes I put up. How many routes? Yeah. I must put up [00:10:05] Cassidy: probably like 20. [00:10:07] Therien: Yeah. Like I main phase happened in two phases. For me. There was the, the first phase where like everything like. Outside of Ely was getting done and the, like, the hanging garden was being developed. Uh, all all that stuff. Just stuff, stuff, stuff, stuff, stuff. And then the next phase was, was E-Gully. I hadn't really gone down into E-Gully 'cause I was like, oh, E-Gully, it's shady. And it's, it's cold in there. It's cold and it's kind of dingy in there, you know, blah, blah blah. Yeah. So I didn't even bother, but then I, I'd kinda. Done everything I. Wanted to do everywhere else on main face. So I was like, well, let's go down in Eagle and see what's going on down there. And it was same thing all over again. Like what? Pow, pow, pow, pow. There's lines everywhere that haven't been done in here. Yeah. And Vader looks awesome, but like what about that? Yeah. What about that? Yeah. Yeah. What about that over there? Uh. Just, yeah, like I would leave all my stuff hidden in the woods at the top of the cliff. I would drive in my Volkswagen bus out early in the morning. I would run in, I would throw my harness on, wrap down something, throw in a couple bolts, work a couple moves. Juma out, stashed my stuff, run back out, drive to the gym and open for 12 noon. [00:11:39] Cassidy: Oh my God. That's this. This is kind of my memory as well, like your, your efforts in all these different chapters are often constrained by very tight timelines. Gotta open the gym, which is to open the gym. [00:11:51] Therien: Got a birthday party at 12. That's right. Yeah. Uh, I'd work on routes like on South Belay. Right. And then wrangle up a belay. For senses. Yeah. Or not like, uh, the two routes I put up down at the bottom of Eagle Gly that veer off. I put up a, like an easy sport route. And then there's two super hard route that veer off from that. Both of those routes, I didn't even have a belayer for. I, I was there and it was, it was kind of wet, like the, it had rained and the rock was kind of wet. Yeah. So I wrapped in. I dried all the holds with chalk. I just dried every single hold on both routes with chalk. And then I jumared out and I chilled a little bit, and then I wrapped in again with my climbing shoes and just like tried a couple moves, seeing the oh holds are dry. Tried a couple Crocs moves. I feel really good. I feel super strong. Okay, cool. Uh, and I got all the way to the bottom and I was like, it seems like conditions are perfect. And I'm feeling super strong. Uh, I gotta go for it. But I don't want like, people to be like, oh, like he did it on top rope, you know? 'cause he was like, like on a, on an ascender. So yeah, I put like a six foot runner between my Ascender and me six. So that runner, I fell like my, my, my self blade device was six feet below me. [00:13:24] Cassidy: Oh. Oh wow. [00:13:25] Therien: Yeah. Dragging up the static line. [00:13:27] Cassidy: Oh, wow. So [00:13:28] Therien: if I peeled, I actually would take [00:13:30] Cassidy: a whip. Oh, okay. This is interesting. Yeah. [00:13:34] Therien: Like I want, [00:13:34] Cassidy: I, I I need the, I need, so why only six feet? [00:13:37] Therien: Yeah. Well, it's about average whip length. You know, I like, so like, I need, I need the whip to be real. Right? And so I need, I need Wow. That mental, I need that mental like. Fear almost of falling. Yeah. Like, you know, to be real. So, uh, when I would work the route, I would always work it. And like the falls were not really a falls, but on those two particular occasions, I made it so that there would be consequences. [00:14:04] Cassidy: And you did both routes back to back. Yeah. In that style? [00:14:07] Therien: Yeah. [00:14:08] Cassidy: Wow. [00:14:08] Therien: It was insane. Yeah, I like that day I climbed, a good friend of ours had passed away a few days earlier. I felt like I was climbing with two strength of two that day. So yeah, it was a magical day. Yeah. And then that was it. I think that might have been the last time I climbed at main face. Those were the last two route I put up and, and then yeah, my, my work there was done. [00:14:34] Cassidy: It's like all this work. Like it, I'm coming back to the theme of suffering. Yeah. Like I think you like suffering, man. There's like so much effort. Yeah. And hard work busting your ass with limited time, lugging loads, hanging [00:14:49] Therien: upside down, drilling bolts. Yeah. And then, yeah, I mean, in between all of that happening, you gotta talk about Cape Clear. [00:14:59] Cassidy: Well, I think that's the next, yeah, that's the next chapter, isn't it? Because Yeah. And like you wanna talk about suffering and like, you, you, the difficulty of hiking in and outta main face. Yeah. Like pales in comparison to what you were doing up at Cape Le. [00:15:15] Therien: Yeah. It's just so completely different. And that consumed [00:15:18] Cassidy: you for another. While, right? Like, [00:15:22] Therien: well, like, yeah, I mean a couple years maybe the just Jesus, just like, I'm exhausted just listening to it. Just, yeah, just the development and, and then climbing alone of Feel the love. Yeah. Was like a six year process. Wow. From getting like the first bolts in on that to like, when, right when you and I climbed that Yeah. Was like a six year process because [00:15:43] Cassidy: you started that, I can't remember who climbed that. You were, you guys were bolting on lead. [00:15:48] Therien: I I, I bolted a bunch of it on repel. And then the weather window closed. Yeah. And that was, it took a year to get back to it. Uh, and then I went back to it, I went back to it with Joe Rossiter. Oh yeah, Joe. Okay. Because yeah, we couldn't, we couldn't bolt the bottom parts on Rappel 'cause it was just too steep. So we wrapped in, he'd never even bolted before. And, and Here, take this drill. What do I do? You know, like Yeah. So we bolted. Yeah, we bolted the, the bottom pitch of that. On lead. Uh, yeah, it was insane. And then, you know, obviously him and I didn't get to climb it. 'cause once again the weather window Yeah. Closed out. And I don't even know if I got back to it the next year. Maybe it was the next year. But yeah, the next time back there after that was, was, was with you. And we kind of had like one shot at it, you know. [00:16:43] Cassidy: Yeah, you kind of dragged me out of semi-retirement at that point. I think so. Yeah. I feel like I wasn't climbing much and you know, my kids were young. Yeah. Wasn't feeling in great shape. Um, but you convinced me to go up. We had an amazing time and yeah, that was, uh, that was an intimidating line. So you, you let me lead the first pitch. You led first pitch. Took us up to the, uh, hanging belay below the, [00:17:09] Therien: yeah, juicy. That juicy belay. Where was it juicy? Was it just kind of wet? [00:17:13] Cassidy: Yeah. Okay. Like, and cold. I remember being really cold actually. Yeah. It was [00:17:16] Therien: kind of, kind of like a little bit shady, a little bit cold, a little bit wet. [00:17:19] Cassidy: Which added to the intimidation factor. [00:17:21] Therien: Yeah. That, that just like right there on that belay for some reason. Yeah. It's not nice. [00:17:26] Cassidy: No. And then that. The pitch above that is the money pitch. It's the face that you can see Yeah, from, from anywhere. This sort of, I don't know how you describe it. Patina, patina, patina covered brownish, [00:17:38] Therien: yeah. The very first time I ever went there. The way like the light was hitting that pitch. Mm-hmm. And I just was like, wow. Oh yeah. That's the most beautiful piece of rock I've seen in a long time. All I could think of was, I wanna climb that someday. [00:17:57] Cassidy: Did you do a lot of that work alone? Like were you up up there Yeah. All by yourself wrapping down and Yeah, I'd wrap down and I'd be on [00:18:04] Therien: the wall by myself for like 8, 9, 10 hours [00:18:08] Cassidy: suffering. Okay. So you had friends up, up running? Yeah. I never went to Cape [00:18:12] Therien: Clear Solo. [00:18:12] Cassidy: Okay, okay. Yeah, [00:18:13] Therien: I never, I never went up there solo. Yeah. I wanted to. Yeah. But, uh, I, I didn't, uh, yeah. Uh, but I might as well have been. 'cause once you're down, once you're over the edge, you know? Yeah. Uh, but Cape Clear, like the chips are down there, that place takes no prisoners. [00:18:29] Cassidy: So is that, uh, field of love, is that one of your proudest routes, would you say? Or like, you, you've done so many, so many things. I don't know how you would pick routes that you are really proud of, but what, what would, what would be on that list for you? [00:18:44] Therien: That route for sure is on the list for me. In terms of like proud routes? Yes. Uh, in terms of like climbing experiences. Mm-hmm. It's probably like number one. Hmm. You know, I got to climb the route of my dreams with my best friend. So what word do you want? [00:19:09] Cassidy: Feel? Love. Yeah. [00:19:10] Therien: Yeah. Uh, proud sins. Uh. There was a trad route I did at the spot that I was pretty proud of. Slice and dice. Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah. I nearly, that's sharp. Real sharp. Yeah. Well, I, I almost cut my thumb off with a pruning saw. Fuck. And, and, and, uh, I still send. With like my thumb wrapped in hockey tape. Right. So that was a proud slice and dice. That was a proud send. Like, okay. Yeah. Slice and Dice is hard. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, I, I quite enjoyed it. I think transformer was a big one for me. I, I [00:19:46] Cassidy: was gonna prompt you for that if you didn't bring it up. Yeah, that's, I think that's one of your best routes that I've been on and yeah. Seen. Yeah. That's a good one. Still. Uh, it's receiving a lot of traffic now, I think. [00:19:59] Therien: Yeah. Yeah. That route I did after I just got back from Ceuse, uh, in, in France. Mm-hmm. And all the routes there have massive run outs, so I was like, I wanna put up a route that kind of reminds me of Ceuse. So I put up transformer and when I did it, when I first bolted it, it only had, I think, three bolts. Mm-hmm. And. I pitched off the crux and nearly decked scratch that plan. I thought maybe I need to add a bolt. Ceuse can keep it. Yeah. And so, so, you know, I think that's important as a developer to, to be willing to adjust your vision of the route. [00:20:42] Cassidy: I think the reality is it's very different to climate for the first time from the ground. It's a different experience and I think, like you're saying, a route developer. Should have that climber in mind? [00:20:54] Therien: Uh, yeah, I think so. [00:20:56] Cassidy: Just jumping, uh, topics here. I asked, I asked Rich, so I interviewed Rich for episode one. Oh, cool. And what is this like episode 20? We're scraping the bottom of the barrel, man. Oh, this is episode two. So I asked Rich if he had any questions for you. Oh, cool. Yeah. So he says, um, of all that you've done, is there a particular route or day that has been especially memorable? [00:21:22] Therien: There's lots of d there's lots of memorable days. There's, there's one in particular that really stands out. Uh, and you were also part of that one. Mm-hmm. And that was the day we did what we referred to as the big stoop. [00:21:35] Cassidy: Oh yeah. Right. Okay. [00:21:37] Therien: Yeah. Uh, driving, driving and driving, like in the desert in the middle of the night with our good friend Colin. Yeah. Him and I came up with this ridiculous idea to like. At the time, climb a route. Mm-hmm. At every like, climbing area in the province. Yeah. In a day. Uh, this is, you know, back in the day when a lot of these areas we talk about didn't exist For sure. And then we did it. You, you, you, uh, and myself and Jonathan, uh, Graham. Yep. And Nacho. Nacho, the dog took him along for the ride. Nacho the dog. Yep. We did. We did it. And I remember that day and I, and I'll never forget that day. It was just, that [00:22:19] Cassidy: was fun. Such [00:22:20] Therien: a ridiculous [00:22:21] Cassidy: thing to do. I didn't sleep a wink the night before. No, man. [00:22:24] Therien: We just, we partied hard till like, I don't know. 2:00 AM [00:22:28] Cassidy: Yeah. And then we had to get up at five or something silly like that. [00:22:32] Therien: We were repelling off the poop deck at Shiprock at 5:00 AM what? [00:22:38] Cassidy: Yeah, we [00:22:39] Therien: like, we got in. So do [00:22:40] Cassidy: you remember, um. Do you remember all the routes? We did? Hundred percent. We started Shiprock, [00:22:45] Therien: we we drove all the way out to Shiprock. Yeah. Paddle paddled. Paddled in the canoe with nacho out to Shiprock, thrashed to the top. Yeah. Wrapped in to that route, which is like insanely hard above the water we wrapped [00:23:00] Cassidy: in. I thought [00:23:01] Therien: you Uh, [00:23:02] Cassidy: no, [00:23:02] Therien: we wrapped off the poop deck. And you led that route. I don't even remember what it is. It's five 10. It's hard. It's nails. Oh, okay. Uh. Yeah. And that started the day success. Yeah. Boom. Done. Okay. Getting, that was one paddle back route. One done drive from Shiprock back to Musquodoboit, we, we missed the turnoff to pace's leg. [00:23:26] Cassidy: Yeah. Speed was everything too. We were like, yeah, well you gotta be on the itinerary. And then we blew the, the second we got a lot of [00:23:32] Therien: driving to do and paddling. Yeah. So. Yeah, we, we missed the turn to Pacers Lake, so we went to Columbus Wall. Yeah, we improvised. Yeah, we improvised, yeah. Change. Yeah. And I forget what we climbed to Columbus Wall. Something. That was five nine. And then we, and then we punched it back to Paces Lake. Yeah. Paddle to Neverland. Right. Climbed the five, nine and Neverland. Mm-hmm. Stopped at main face. Did uh, farewell to arms first face. We did blue sky mining. Why not just do a, oh yeah, that's right. 5, 5 11. [00:24:04] Cassidy: There we go. Throw a five 11. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Spice it up. [00:24:07] Therien: Yeah. Jump in the van. Drive to Eagles Nest. Uh, yeah. We ran, we ran into Eagles Nest evening Wall, I think it's called. Yeah, we did Evening wall at Eagles Nest. Remember those guys like whatcha, are you guys doing doing route? What do you guys do? We're leaving. We had like, we didn't like that route. We were like literally tied to the rope in the parking lot with like three pieces of gear. Oh, we just [00:24:31] Cassidy: ran [00:24:31] Therien: in. We ran in, threw down, ran out. It was [00:24:33] Cassidy: hot. [00:24:34] Therien: I remember. Was so hot. Very hot right then. [00:24:36] Cassidy: Yeah. It was [00:24:36] Therien: disgusting. Yeah. Uh. Then we drove out to, okay, back to the [00:24:39] Cassidy: Scooby-Doo van, [00:24:40] Therien: back to the Scooby Doo van. Drove out to Terrance Bay, paddle over to Crow's Nest. Oh yeah. Climbed to five nine there. Yeah. Paddle back. Uh, like the fact that you could just paddle over there and, and on that particular day. Yeah. We [00:24:53] Cassidy: got lucky with the Yeah. We probably didn't even pay attention to what was happening in terms of swell or maybe not. Yeah. You just got lucky. Yeah. [00:24:59] Therien: Uh, then we did, uh, route at Easter Island. Yeah. And then we finished the day at Anne. Yeah, we did. Uh, it's a big day. That laidback route, whatever that one's called. Recognition. Recognition, yeah. De recognition. Finished the day on top of, so end. [00:25:13] Cassidy: And that was the big stupid, big [00:25:15] Therien: stupid. Yeah. Sounds pretty stupid. It was dumb. [00:25:17] Cassidy: Yeah. But no, it's nice to set those silly goals and Yeah. And do them right. That was, [00:25:21] Therien: yeah, it was great. Uh, that day was amazing. Uh. I remember being, yeah, climbing, climbing with you up at Cape Clear that day number one with a bull on the list. That was amazing. Yeah. Uh, yeah, there were, the day I climbed at eagerly by myself, that was, that was a pretty cool day. Neat. Yeah. That was, that was, yeah, that was just a weird, I was just, yeah, weird. Like a weird, a weird day. That was amazing. Uh, yeah. [00:25:53] Cassidy: And you had Mark in your mind then, I think. Yeah, totally. [00:25:56] Therien: Yeah. Just like, wow, you know, super nice guy. Knew him really well. Just there and then gone. [00:26:03] Cassidy: Yeah. Yeah. [00:26:03] Therien: Uh, yeah. [00:26:07] Cassidy: Yeah. There's lots of days though, man, like it's climbing. Consumed a large part of your life. [00:26:14] Therien: I think another one of my favorite days was the day I did, like, I did a hundred boulderer problems on Dover Island. [00:26:20] Cassidy: Oh, I remember that. Yeah. Yeah. [00:26:22] Therien: Like one year at Boulderer Fest. I was like, [00:26:24] Cassidy: you kind of went on your own script and Yeah. I wanted, I want to do a [00:26:27] Therien: hundred problems. Yep. And I just went off and did a hundred problems. [00:26:34] Cassidy: It was insane. Um. Scariest moments that you've had climbing [00:26:40] Therien: scariest moments? Uh, early on in my climbing career, like I had friends who died climbing and, and that, that really made me just like pay maybe a little bit more attention to safety stuff than other people might. Uh. And understand like how climbing systems work and like what's safe, what's not safe, and never putting myself into a position where I'm doing something that's not safe. Does that make sense? [00:27:14] Cassidy: Oh my God. It's, it's, it's a serious endeavor and we can take it a little bit too casually sometimes. Yeah. I need to bone up on my systems and. I think that's wise. Yeah. For all of us to Yeah. A reality check, you know? [00:27:27] Therien: Yeah. I always made sure like no shortcuts. [00:27:30] Cassidy: Yeah. You know, like double check, triple check. [00:27:33] Therien: Yeah. Double check. Triple check. Yeah. If you don't check my knot, I don't climb with you. [00:27:37] Cassidy: Mm. Mm-hmm. You [00:27:38] Therien: know? [00:27:39] Cassidy: Yeah. Good, good policy. [00:27:40] Therien: If I had lots of scary moments, I wouldn't be climbing. Mm. Because like, it's supposed to be fun. That's a, that's, yeah. That's when you're terrified outta your mind. That's, that's not fun. [00:27:51] Cassidy: Yeah. Um, so I know this is a little touchy, but just to kind of round out the story of your climbing. Yeah. Career. Uh, you started the cl the climbing gym, what did you say? 90 [00:28:06] Therien: 98. [00:28:06] Cassidy: 98. [00:28:07] Therien: Yeah. [00:28:08] Cassidy: And then unfortunately it closed a few years back, and I think that was as a result of the COVID Pandemic. [00:28:14] Therien: Yep. [00:28:15] Cassidy: To a large degree. [00:28:16] Therien: Yep. [00:28:16] Cassidy: Um, that must have been a sad moment to Yeah. Close those doors. [00:28:26] Therien: It was, yeah. It was, uh. It was pretty tough. [00:28:30] Cassidy: Yeah, [00:28:30] Therien: yeah, yeah. What are you gonna do? You know, we, uh, we, we, we were open for I think, 22 years. We battled snowstorms, we battled competitor gyms opening and closing. We, uh, we battled massive increases in, in overhead in terms of insurance. Things that you completely can't control, you know? Uh, all this stuff we battled through, uh, and, and at the end of the day, it took like a hundred year global pandemic to finally to take you out, you know, put us down. Yeah. So I take, I guess I take some pride in that. Yeah, man. You know, uh, but yeah, that was a sad day. I felt really bad for, uh, everyone that looked at ground zero as like a, a safe place to go and express themselves. [00:29:27] Cassidy: Yeah. So, yeah. Yeah, yeah. It was a safe place for weirdos. Yeah. I think [00:29:32] Therien: definitely. [00:29:33] Cassidy: Right. And I mean, the influence that, that you personally and that Jim, because of you had on the community. To this day. I mean, how many climbers are out there now that kind of grew up as kids in your gym? There's, there's a lot of them. [00:29:49] Therien: It, there's, it's, it's kind of gotten to a point now that's really kind of strange and weird for me a little bit in that there are now tons of kids that are climbing and like doing fun activities and their parents met. At ground zero. Wow. And so like, I'm like, am I like responsible now for like hookups from like kids, kids? You know, like there was a lot of people who, you know, met. Fell in love. [00:30:26] Cassidy: Yeah, that's true. [00:30:27] Therien: Their lives, who they are now as people, uh, are kind of like a direct byproduct of, of, of, of that gym, you know? Uh, and, and that's kind of a weird legacy that's, that I never anticipated. Interesting. You know, I anticipated, yeah, climbing's huge in the province now because like, woo. You know, but, well, there's that, you know, I never anticipated having like. Families Right. That, that exist. Right. And, uh, and thrive and grow because of my gym. Yeah. Yeah. So, uh, that's pretty cool. That's, that's a weird thing. And I think that's, I think that's pretty cool. Yeah. That's, I'm almost more proud of that than the routes. [00:31:11] Cassidy: Nice. Yeah. What, uh, I know you said earlier that you, um, you're not really climbing these days. And maybe you'll get back to it. Maybe you don't, maybe you won't, I don't know. But what, how would, how do you reflect on that life of climbing that you had pretty intensely, more intensely than most any of us. You've lived that climbing life for, I don't know what that would be, 30 years, 35 years or so. Something. Yeah, much. Yeah. What, uh, what does that, what does that mean, or what does that feel like when you think about that? [00:31:47] Therien: Yeah, that's a good question. You know, uh, it's, it's, I often, like, I, it's, it's hard to express. It almost feels like sometimes it happened to someone else. Mm. Like that window of my life was someone else's life because I've, I've so completely. Kind of gotten out of the climbing scene that it almost feels like it wasn't even me that did all those things. Like it was, it was someone else entirely like, and sometimes I think back to like. Like some of the stuff that I've done and I'm like, no way. Like, are you kidding? I didn't do that. Like, no, like, and just this discussion with you, this conversation with you bringing up, you know, all these memories and stuff. So [00:32:45] Cassidy: many things. Yeah. [00:32:45] Therien: I still look at it as like I'm viewing it through like a lens. And it's someone else that's doing all that stuff. [00:32:53] Cassidy: Yeah. It just like seems an out of body kind of experience. [00:32:56] Therien: Totally. Yeah. It seems unfathomable. [00:32:58] Cassidy: Mm-hmm. [00:32:59] Therien: That I did all that stuff. Uh, and yet I did, and here I am, you know? Uh, so yeah, it's, uh, it's, it's, it's a weird thing. I don't like, I don't think about it that often. Uh. I, I'm, I'm, I'm, I'm much more like, concentrated on like, the present [00:33:24] Cassidy: mm-hmm. [00:33:25] Therien: And the future and, and than, than the past. Uh, so yeah, I, I, I certainly cherish and appreciate, you know, all those moments indoors, outdoors. Everything. Uh, and, and, and I, and I wouldn't be who I am if it wasn't for those things. And my core group of friends, the people who mean the most to me, all exist 'cause of that. Uh, so I guess I haven't completely written that chapter of my life off. I ne I never will, you know? Uh. Yeah. Yeah. It's, but it, it is kind of a weird thing. I think if I was maybe a little bit younger and a little bit more physically like able, maybe I'd consider climbing more. [00:34:12] Cassidy: Yeah. [00:34:13] Therien: But like, it hurts to climb now, you know, one, like if I go, if I go bouldering a little bit. It hurts. I'm, I'm really hurt and sore and afraid, like I'm afraid of injuring myself. Blowing at an elbow. Blowing at a shoulder. You know, like I had multiple injuries over the years of climbing. Ruptured tendons in my hands, tendonitis, blowing shoulders, you know, broken ankle, like multiple injuries from climbing. And those are all still there. Uh, so the idea of like climbing appeals to me, but there's fear. Interesting that I would injure myself and not be able to recover from like a blown shoulder, like a ruptured rotator cuff or a bicep ripping off the bone. You know, like I, so I, that, that makes me nervous to, to, [00:35:19] Cassidy: is that, what, is that what keeps you away, would you say? Or is it just that you've. You've done that, that was part of your life, that was part of this like, uh, surreal sort of your life, part of your life that maybe it's hard to imagine you even lived. Are, did you just close that and you're happily moving into another phase? [00:35:37] Therien: The thing that makes it easy for me to not climb is I don't really have any interest in indoor climbing. Uh, that much, which is ironic. Yeah, yeah. Uh, 'cause 'cause I would probably injure myself. Uh, and the thing that drew me to climbing in Nova Scotia particularly was the adventure of exploration and the adventure of developing those two things. Climbing the routes was almost like secondary. To like finding them and developing them. Mm-hmm. Getting, getting the first ascent was a bonus. Like if I didn't get the first ascent, well I still got to develop and find, so I got to accomplish two of the three things that are awesome. Uh, so like I could be happy with maybe not getting an fa on something, uh, having. Done and put up so many routes and so many problems, I don't really see anywhere else for me to go in the province for development. [00:36:56] Cassidy: Right. That was the real joy that when you look back, that was really what, that's what excited you. Yeah. And yeah. I mean, you've been there, done that kind of thing, you know? Yeah. That, that was my [00:37:07] Therien: driving, my driving my driver. Mm-hmm. Would've been. Finding, developing, climbing. Yeah. Yeah. And what now that the finding and developing part is kind of gone, 'cause you know, it seems kind of like maybe the golden age of development to Nova Scotia potentially might be over maybe, I don't know. I don't look anymore. But without those first two things, then not all that leaves is climbing. Right. And. I've climbed everything in the province that I'm capable of climbing. Mm. Multiple times over. [00:37:44] Cassidy: Yeah. [00:37:45] Therien: So I can't, I can't, I can't push myself difficulty wise 'cause I'm, I'm too decrepit and I. Exploration wise, I don't really have the time anymore to, to do that. Uh, so the things that I loved about climbing, I can't, I can't really get those anymore. Uh, so it's easier for me just to not climb Gotcha. Than to, yeah. Just go out and do a route that I've already done a hundred times. Mm-hmm. It, that, that doesn't really hold any interest for me. I totally understand. Yeah. Or like I. If I climb at all now, it's like going somewhere on a summer day and, and doing some easy bouldering, like bunch of easy zeros and just chill, relaxing. [00:38:33] Cassidy: Yeah. [00:38:34] Therien: Like at the beach. [00:38:36] Cassidy: But you, you, you're not decrepit. You're not decrepit. Were shifting what seems to me you're shifting kind of full cycle. [00:38:45] Therien: Yeah. [00:38:45] Cassidy: Back to. Where we started this conversation about your original passion, it seems of two wheels, biking, two wheels. Tell us about the craziness you've got on the go now. And surprise, surprise, it involves suffering. [00:39:02] Therien: Oh, no, there's not gonna be that much suffering. I'm only gonna ride from like one end of the province to the other in, you know, two days. [00:39:11] Cassidy: So this is a race you've told me about, which sounds really cool. Tip to tip an underground race. [00:39:15] Therien: Tip to tip, uh, it's a ultra endurance cycling race. Mm-hmm. We ride from the southernmost point of Nova Scotia to the northernmost point, uh, making a couple stops along the way. Uh, completely self-supported. You have a five day window to, uh, complete the route, but you're gonna wanna do it two and a half. That's what I'm gonna wanna do anyway. That's my target. Two and a half. [00:39:47] Cassidy: Sweet. Yeah. So, uh, and training to, to get up to speed for that. Tell us about your training. [00:39:53] Therien: Training's been insane. It's basically like, do the wrong longest ride you've ever done in your entire life. And then like, multiply that by two and then do that two days in a row and then do that every week for like two months with a whole bunch of other writing on top of that. So I'm logging like. 25 to 30 hour hours a week. In the saddle. [00:40:17] Cassidy: Insane. Yeah, it's, that sounds sore. It's gonna be insane. Well, good luck on that race. Thanks, man. And thanks so much for joining me here. This has been a lot of fun. [00:40:28] Therien: No, it's great, man. It's been wonderful. Thank you for having me. It's been a pleasure. [00:40:32] Cassidy: Thanks, brother. [00:40:32] Therien: Yeah. Cheers, man. [00:40:36] Cassidy: All right. Thanks so much, Sean. What a legend you are. As an update for listeners, Sean did in fact complete the attempt to tip race. He finished fourth. And covered almost 300 kilometers a day for four days in a row. How's that for suffering? Thanks again to Granite Guides for sponsoring this episode. If you are just starting to climb outdoors, these guys are a great resource to learn the basics and climb safely. They also have more advanced courses for lead climbing and multi-pitch rescues. Look them up@graniteguides.ca to learn more. So that's it for now. I hope you enjoyed listening to the show. You can find out more about each episode at ice. Fox sessions ca please like and follow, catch you later. [00:41:24] Therien: Oh, it's sharp. Like really sharp. I, I hope I lived up to the other 25 people you invited before me. 25. That's been [00:41:32] Cassidy: 35. 30. 35. Yeah. There's always new lunatics coming through.